You have to give this bunch of fighting Razorbacks credit – they know how to play it close. Games continue to come down to just a possession or two difference. Since South Carolina is pretty much a March Madness lock, I feel pretty good about our performance on the road. However . . .
In a review of the stat sheet Courtney Fortson’s 10 turnover performance jumped out at me. So, I thought it would be fun to take a closer look at his performance during the game . . . and the Hogs performance while he was in the game.
While Fortson was on the floor during the first half the Hogs were beaten 11-4. While he was out of the game the Hogs won by 22-14. In the second half the Hogs outscored South Carolina 6-5 while he was out and 36-31 while he was in. Counting the overtime, the Hogs outscored South Carolina 28-23 while he was out and got outscored 63-51 while he was in.
For regulation the Hogs scored 2.5 points a minute when Fortson was not in the game and 1.34 points a minute when he was in the game.
While the newspapers made a big deal of rebounding down the stretch, for the last 7:22 of regulation each team got six rebounds. South Carolina had five of their six on offense. The Hogs had three offensive rebounds and three defensive rebounds. SC had nine points from their offensive rebounds while the Hogs had six points from their offensive rebounds.
Courtney Fortson hit a three-pointer at 7:22 to put the Hogs up 53-50. Following that, he had five turnovers, three rebounds and two points. SC got six of their points in the last 7:22 on possessions following turnovers. They got two offensive rebounds following turnovers. They outscored the Hogs 16-13 during that time.
Jason Henry was the star down the stretch with nine points and two offensive rebounds while having one turnover. Michael Washington had two fouls, one assist and no rebounds down the stretch. Didn’t take a shot.
Six turnovers down the stretch. Six possessions without getting a shot.
This is just stat sheet stuff. What does it really mean?
As Jason Henry develops you can see the impact a ‘long’ 6’6″ guard can have on the game. 11-18 shooting, 12 rebounds and nine points down the stretch. We are playing teams that have 3 or 4 Jason Henry’s.
The Hogs die on jump shots. They didn’t get to the foul line once in the last seven minutes. SC was 3 of 5 on foul shots. Washington not getting a shot during that span means we weren’t getting the ball into the paint to our big guy.
It’s time to play Clarke at point guard. Welsh and Fortson are turnover machines. (Welsh had five in 28 minutes). Clarke played point in High School, is a great ball handler, a snappy passer, has good court sense and offers an outside threat to spread the floor that Fortson doesn’t. This offense has been built around Fortson’s penetration skills. Bad decision in my view.
Turnovers – careless possessions – are killing us in these close games. When your point guard has five turnovers down the stretch in a close game it is hard to win. Take care of the ball and you probably win this basketball game.
I know we are young and a few players away. I also know we are blowing games we are in great position to win because of carelessness. We are good enough to get into position. We have to learn what it takes to win close games.
Winning close games requires a mentality first and foremost. Take care of possessions. Solid half-court offense. Get the ball into the paint. Get to the foul line. Make free throws. Get stops on defense. Make them work hard and take time to get a good shot. Get ahead and stay ahead. Make them chase you.
When the game is close down the stretch the team that ignores the formula or makes the most mistakes loses. Talent and hustle can only get you so far. The toughest distance in basketball, as in golf, is the one between your ears.
You make good points HogBlogger.
Youth is one thing, certainly a real thing. Playing a high school team in the SEC is no one's idea of a good time.
But, if you look at the development of this team you don't see a lot of coaching going on. It is all kind of paint by numbers stuff with no new ideas, new combinations, a stubborn refusal to react to the facts. Pelphry has fallen in love with Fortson and it is killing his chances to develop a basketball team. You know you have a real point guard when you score inside and your jump shooters get their shots. We do neither on anything resembling a consistent basis. Despite Washington being the strength of this team he is virtually ignored most of the time.
I like the kid too (really.) But, when you look at this team, this year, it could have, should have been a rebuilding year. It seems like too much building was scrapped in favor of winning and we got neither.
But, yes, we are very young, very short handed, and pretty small for an SEC team. I don't put too much stock in these close victories. I can't imagine anyone taking us too seriously. (South Carolina was very flat to start the game.)
I hope the rumors are false. If Pelphry is headed for a trainwreck, it could be really ugly. Sports is about winning for the kids as well. We have seen way to much hype to sell tickets in this program for the last 5 years. Raising expectations too high is a dangerous game. You can't blame that on the fans or even the media. The Razorbacks are the only game in town. Access is paramount. But, if you hide the facts, and then they surface, you have made your own bed. I hope they have learned their lesson this time. They obviously didn't last time.
Great post.
Well, anyone reading my comments of late would know I love this post. I have not meant to rant on Fortson or Sanchez, but the deficiencies of their games is overwhelmingly obvious. These are good kids trying to win games for the Hogs and they cannot fix what is wrong with their games overnight. That is where coaching comes in and I am concerned that they are not receiving enough or the right coaching. We all know this was supposed to be a rebuilding year. Just like football was.
And, like football, if your quarterback is throwing way more interceptions than touchdowns, somethings gotta give. Either a different quarterback or different scheme. We face a similar dilemma with this basketball team. Casey never threw interceptions as wildly as Courtney turns it over. Oh, yeah, maybe the Alabama pick-six fest.
Great post, up until putting Clark at point. In my opinion, SEC defenders would eat his lunch. He would have 10, if not more, turnovers a game. Fortson is the only point we currently have. If he is learning from his mistakes, we'll be better for it next year. We'll see. Keep fighting Hogs!!!
BlindHog – totally agree with you. Teams are overlooking us, but that's an opportunity to steal a couple of wins.
Ward_Hog – you could well be right about Clarke. I just think it would be worth taking a look. He's pretty skilled with the ball. Not so great on moving without the ball and shooting off the catch. I'd try Clarke, Henry, Moore, Clark and Washington as a combo and see what happens for a few minutes. They've got offensive sets that would work with that combo. You'd force the other team to match up with you at any rate.
T-towner – I'm with you. I don't see us getting better right now. Pelphrey used one 30 second timeout down the stretch. I didn't check to see what he had left, but I would hope there were a couple. I don't see us mixing it up and trying different things,
If Fortson played for my high school coach he'd be running some serious bleachers for all those turnovers.
Another day, another bashing of Fortson on Razorbloggers.net. I've come to expect this on a daily basis, or at least after a game. News flash everyone….since the point guard handles the ball every offensive possession, he will have more turnovers! HogBlogger, it would be interesting to see who SC was playing when Fortson was out – did they substitute the person that was guarding Fortson as well? Perhaps good defense is a key consideration here.
I agree Fortson still needs development, and that at times he is out of control, but HE IS A FRESHMAN. You can't expect a freshman to play like a jr or sr folks.
And replace Fortson with Clarke? Are you kidding me? And someone mentions that Clarke was PG in high school so he is a better option than Fortson? Oklahoma high school ball is a long way from the SEC folks. And Clarke was the subject of razorblogger bashing a few weeks ago…my how quickly the focus turns.
My opinion is that Fortson has the skills and potential to be one of the greatest PG's the Hogs have ever had. The key for any college player is to get experience, and Fortson is getting tons of that this year. For you impatient 'fans', next year or the following year you will see the great benefit of your suffering this year. Fortson, Henry, Clarke and even Sanchez will bring us back to the top of the SEC and perhaps the nation. These youngsters have kept us relatively competitive against much more experienced teams….AND THEY ARE FRESHMAN….basically a high school team!
You all should encourage these talented kids for what they will give us in the future, not bash them every week from your pulpit…shame on you.
Clarke is not a better point guard than Fortson. Let's end that debate right now. Yes it is frustrating, (i can't even listen to the game on the radio without going crazy) but these kids are going to be beast……….the key is getting a quality PG to play along side or play behind Fortson and some bulk in the middle…………..we'll be OK………..Let's not forget, this season is the reason UA got rid of Heath. They knew this was coming (5 freshman) and they wanted a "new" coach to bring in the players.
I think the point of suggesting the Clarke play point is not to say that he is better than Fortson, but more responsible than Fortson with the ball. Fortson's last 3 games he has had 12 assists and 20 turnovers. Three games before that he was playing at a more semi more responsible level dishing out 22 assists and 15 turnovers.
Clarke shows signs of being much better at setting up the offense and distributing the basketball. He would not be the "get in the lane" creator that Fortson is, but he also wouldn't be the potential disaster zone that Fortson has the ability to be on a play by play basis.
Right now we live and die by Fortson. In SEC play we've lived once…. and died 10 times. Furthermore, Fortson has 4 games in which he had a positive assist/turnover ratio, 2 pushes, and 5 in the negative.
I am looking to the jr college player that is a true point guard that they are recruiting for next year out of Florida. You are nuts if you think Clarke is the answer for out point guard of the future. He is not slow, but at the same time is not strong or quick enough to play point. I don't think Fortson is good enough yet to play point either. This year is done. Start looking forward to next year with a few of these freshmen (Clarke and Henry) as well as Washington with a couple of new faces. That is your team.
Washington is headed to the NBA.
It's time. I'm ready. Let's spend a few hundred K for a couple years and bring Nolen in as a defensive consultant to teach his "huevos" trapping press to the kids and to Pelphrey. It would be great healing for the program, and it would be a chance to get a little taste of 40 minutes again.
I believe R.Clarke would be a better option coming off the bench behind Fortson.
My reasoning for this is not only because I think Clarke would help keep Fortson in check with a more responsible court awareness, but also would allow us to keep a taller, more physical line up on the floor, more often.
It's been very well known from the beggining of the season that Clarke was supposed to be a great 3 pt. shooter, and he is. The only problem with this is that he's only 6'0" tall.
The reason he starts is because of that uncanny ability, and because he probably has the best court demeanor and basketball IQ on the floor.
In the SEC, if your a 6'0" SG, you already have a major disadvantage, not to even mention he's a Freshman just trying to get his feet wet, and it doesn't help when your surrounded by other players that are in the same boat, exsperience-wise.
Here's the lineup I would try to experiment with:
Starting lineup
PG – Fortson
SG – Welsh
SF/SG – Henry
PF – Moore
C – Washinton
Backups
PG – Clarke
SG – Britt
PF – Sanchez
C – Clark
There's really not many options you can go with, as long we have no depth, experience, or size, at some of the key positions.
I think Pelphrey is scared to bring Clarke off the bench because he doesn't want him to think about (much less consider) transferring. I'd explain to him you are going to get the same amout of minutes, we just need more of a spark off the bench. Plus this would force the opposing team to adjust to him coming in stroking and they'd be a little winded already. Just a suggestion……
GonzoHog – I'm on the same page with you.
Some of you guys – you are putting more words into my post than I'm actually saying. I never said Clarke was the point guard of the future. Never even thought it. I never said he was better at point guard than Fortson. Never even thought that. I just think he will do a better job of taking care of the ball. He rarely turns it over. I don't worry at all about his quickness or ball handling or strength. I've seen every home game in person, so I've watched him quite a bit to form my opinions.
I would play him there about 10 minutes a game and see what happens. After all, the season is done and we need to look at options and combinations and try and improve for next year.
It's not fair to state something I didn't say and take me to task over the thing I didn't say. But do it if you want to. I think all of this is quite fun.
I get the whole young and let's just have patience then as well as anyone. I also get that we are losing some games that we have a good chance of winning right now because we are careless about too many possessions.
Fortson and Welsh had 15 turnovers combined against South Caroline. Fortson had 5 in the last 7 minutes of the game.
Hog bballfan – am I bashing Fortson or just telling it like it is? Give me better stats and I'll have a reason not to talk about him so much. A 10 turnover performance by the point guard with 5 down the stretch of a game that went into overtime deserves to be pointed out. You're not hearing it from the press or the coaches (although it is way on their mind – thus the recruiting of a JuCo point guard), and probably not everyone studies the stat sheets, so I'm just trying to round out the picture.
My issues right now concern the present. 1) I don't see us getting better at things that are costing us ball games. If anything we are regressing. 2) The fact that we are staying Fortson centric and not improving, trying other combinations, of doing something, concerns me about the coaching.
Also . . . Washington has no business even thinking NBA. He is not strong enough to play NBA ball. Nor does he have the defensive or offensive skills that would be needed. He needs to hang around and work on his languages.
NBA ready or not, don't count on Washington being back next year.
The NBA has a longer, more accurate evaluation period for underclassman which I think will result in the return of Washington.
On the subject of Wally Hall's article this morning and coaching dominoes, the most important thing that could happen to help us out is for Calipari to head to Arizona. Our decline in b-ball has coincided to a great degree with being shut out of Memphis. Nolan's great teams always had a heavy dose of memphis products and we need to get back into that market. And this tall kid from Memphis is not what I have in mind.
Did somebody say fair?
Guys, there's a flip side to all of this. Pelphrey may be reluctant to change lineups because some of these players aren't completely out of his doghouse just yet, Jason Henry inparticular.
Pelphrey was quoted as saying after the SC game, he just wants Henry to concentrate on the other important things in life right now, (like going to class) and that he's comfortable with Henry just continuing to come off the bench.
Moore and Fortson have had their episodes with disapline as well, so I think at this stage in their carrers, Pelphrey's doing his very best just to make sure these kids keep everything that's really important in perspective.
If he continues to do that, and these players continue to progress under the right guidelines, the sky will be the limit in couple of more years.
Just like Petrino exsperienced this past season, you have to endure the bad times, be patient, and stay the course, before you can implement your own system into place. That's just the way it is.
Gonzo – yep, these guys stay in the doghouse and I think that has played into things. Moore has stayed in the doghouse most of the time it seems. Seems like the doghouse is pretty easy to get into for some.
Carolina – I agree on the Memphis thoughts. Good points.
Reason – yep, I said fair. I would be nuts if I thought Clarke was the point guard of the future. However, I never said anything even remotely close to that. We can disagree all day long over things we think and actually say and I'm fine with it. Disagreeing with me over something I didn't think as well as telling me I'm nuts is not fair. I could easily say, "thinking the JuCo point guard that you are 'looking to' is better option than Forston is a stupid opinion on your part". Of course, that's not exactly what you said and is an unfair take-away from your thoughts. See how it works?
Thats fair
Stupid is hurtful. I find a state of being nuts to be inspiring.
Wooooooooooo Pig Soooooooooooooie!!!! I love this site!!! We love our Hogs so much. They are the ONLY show in town! I don't like the 'win now or we need another coach' approach, but this is good fun. I habitually come back daily to see what is being said. Fun stuff…
I love our coach and our players. My passion makes me wish Fortson would have more assists than turnovers, that Sanchez would stay within himself and we could count on 70%+ free throws. I do not think it is bashing Fortson to point out the obvious——he needs to play at 70 mph instead of 90 mph. If he does that he will increase his assists, reduce his turnovers and we will win more games. Whether Fortson scores double figures does not seem important to the end result.
Hogblogger, I see your post (and others) as Fortson bashing because you are calling him out as a key reason for our results this season. Since you're all about fairness….it's not fair. Since you are a stats guy, here's some info for you….guess who leads the SEC in assists per game? Calathes is #1, with Fortson close behind (6.4 and 6.2 respectively). Guess who leads the SEC in turnovers per game? You're right, Fortson is #1, then Downey, the Calathes (4.6, 3.6, and 3.3 respectively). What does that tell you? Give or take one possesion per game, Fortson has almost the same turnover/assist ratio as some of the top players in the SEC. How about one more stat….Fortson is the ONLY freshman in the SEC in the top 20 in points per game (#13).
My point….in my opinion, the commentary you and others portray as 'telling it like it is' is not accurate. A reader would be led to believe that Fortson is the primary cause for our performance this season. That is not true at all. The facts are Fortson is one of the best players in the league based on PG relevant stats, AND HE IS ONLY A FRESHMAN. Freshman teams do not win close games. Expereince plays a key role in tight games, of which we have very little. The killer for the Hogs this year has been our 3 pt defense and rebounding, not necessarily point guard play. My suggestion is to focus your diatribe on that vs bashing a kid that is doing an outstanding job this year straight out of high school.
Like I said before, shame on you. I'm just telling it like it is based on facts.
Hog bball fan, just an FYI but HogBlogger has been an equal opportunity basher… Fortson hasn't been the only player "bashed"… in fact, I'm not sure who hasn't been at one time or another.
To your point about the slight difference (about 1+ net difference)… just how many games could have turned on this 1+ difference? I'm in the camp that says… go 70 mph vs. 90 and the impact may be significantly greater but in the other direction… that is, he probably has more assists and fewer turnovers. Wouldn't that be a huge difference? Could the wins be more and the loses fewer… I'm thinking so.
Finally, the difference between first game of the year and the last game of this year is important from your freshman comments. Has Fortson grown much during this timeframe or is he still making freshman mistakes? Keeping in mind that he's play significantly more than most freshmen. I really don't know the answer to this question but that's what is probably troubling folks. He can't be doing the same thing all year and not growing as a player. The quicker he (and all of the other freshmen) make this transition, the sooner we make it over the hump.
You may be speaking about facts… but you need ALL of the facts to tell the true story.
Dragnet?
Growing up and becoming mature, in the mental aspect of the game, is just as important as the repetitions you go through.
Owasso makes a good point about the same Freshman mistakes being made over and over, but some kids just take longer than others.
I do believe that it wouldn't be fair to just single out Fortson, anymore than it would be to single out Sanshez, Clarke, or Henry.
He's the PG, and naturally will be handling the basketball a lot more often, leading to the most turnovers.
One of these days though, that proverbial light is going to come on, consistantsy will prevail, and the arguments we're having over these youngsters will be all but history.
GO HOGS GO BABY!!!!!
I would single out Sanchez the most because he is so incredibly slow.
Maybe their worst effort of the year underway at Tuscaloosa.
Guys, I'm on Fortson for three main reasons. 1) I've watched him a lot – every home game. He's not growing. 2) He's making the most mistakes at critical times. 5 turnovers in the last 7 minutes against South Carolina. 3) The only place you've read about he 5 turnovers in the last 7 minutes – as well as several other comments about some of the play – is RazorBloggers. Everyone else is so in awe of him, or so understanding of him being a freshman, that they are barely referring to the negatives about his play.
I called Clarke a "ball boy" and didn't hear any criticism from that. I'm made several comments about Washington and I'm not hearing any criticism for that. I've said things about Welsh and Britt and I've not heard any criticism for that.
You guys should notice that I had nothing to say until late December, and that I've only ramped it up lately. Reason – I wanted to give them time to develop and see how they were going to look around the middle of conference season on. As to the comment that I should consider his stats for the entire season to be fair – Nope, don't agree. It's not okay to make 5 turnovers in the last 7 minutes of an SEC game in the last half of the conference season just because you played lights out for 7 minutes in early December.
The point guard makes or breaks a team. The leadership from point guard makes a huge difference down the stretch. The bigger question is, "why isn't he growing?" I know, the answer is "he is just a freshman, what do you expect?" My retort would be, "I expect to see him getting better – which in his case is mostly mental".
They are losing games by 1-3 possessions. Turnovers are a huge deal. Fix that and I'll move on to someone else.